Catholics Furious Over Anti-Christian Penn and Teller Show
Catholic League president Bill Donohue comments on last night’s edition of Penn & Teller’s show. The program aired on Showtime which is owned by CBS:The Nazis couldn’t have done better. Having been in this job for over 16 years, I have never seen a more defamatory, obscene and vicious show on TV. And I mean about any religious or demographic group—not just Catholics. The lies about the Catholic Church, to say nothing of the vile language used by Penn Jillette, were positively astounding. Moreover, it never attempted to be comedic—from the very beginning it advertised the show as payback for 2,000 years of alleged crimes. This was Julius Streicher back from the grave.
In this half-hour show, the Catholic Church was blamed for every evil in history. Jillette said the “intolerance, greed, paranoia, hypocrisy and callous disregard for human suffering” was the hallmark of the Catholic Church. Others on the show branded the Church an “amoral” and “power hungry” institution that is just worried about its “cash flow.”
Jillette lied about the Vatican’s reaction to Sabina Guzzanti, an Italian foul-mouthed comedian who staged an assault on the pope in 2008: the pope never sought to throw “her sexy ass in jail” and never once sought any punitive measure against her—it’s all a bald face lie! Jillette lied about a 1962 Vatican document—it was a statement about penalties for priests who used the confessional to solicit sex: it was not a cover-up for sexual misconduct! He lied about Pope Benedict XVI—he had absolutely nothing to do with overseeing cases of priestly sexual misconduct in the United States! And so on.
Spokesmen for Catholics for Choice, SNAP and Dignity—three anti-Catholic groups that lie about their Catholic status—twisted, distorted and ridiculed Church teachings on sexuality.
I have asked to meet with Les Moonves of CBS. On Monday, we will have a mass mailing of DVD copies of this episode to bishops and religious leaders across the nation. This cannot go unanswered.
Catholics Furious Over Anti-Christian Penn and Teller Show
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Watch for yourself...
The video can be found here: http://vimeo.com/6321872
It does treat the pope rather harshly, deserving so, but it does not directly attack Catholics as a whole.
- MrBook
August 30, 2009 9:00PM
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Don't turn the focus
on the adjectives used in the show. It doesn't matter how they described the events. I have a hard time believing the whole show was a lie, and in fact if even one bit of it were true, there is no right to be offended by the harsh words. History never looks good when truth is presented without a bias justification to cover it up. Whether stating that the earth is the center of the universe, denouncing gays, or conquering empires to create new ones, the church has forever and always pushed their views and been open and forceful about them. Time to step down and at the very least acknowledge crossing the line.
- levi944
August 30, 2009 9:14PM
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Why aren't they valid
in being angry at the lies told, even though there were truths told as well?
- quantummechanik September 3, 2009 12:24AM
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I'd say
because it's not just anger at the lies told versus truth told. It's anger at the fact these things were presented at all, and at the manner in which they were presented. It's anger at the fact Penn and Teller are angry. There is zero distinction between fact and fiction between either side. The truth is that nobody can speak for anyone else, regardless of background. This is why I say that at the very least, the church needs to step back and admit the truths that occurred on the program as well as put in their piece on the lies. Only they have been doing that since the conception of Catholicism, and so it's all been underplayed to say the least. Even though I believe it's right to be angry at misinformation, I also believe that truth needs to be acknowledged and anger placed where it belongs. Not just thrown about with accusations of slander.
- levi944
September 3, 2009 12:40AM
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Also
I originally said there is no right to be offended by harsh words. I didn't say there is no right to be angry.
- levi944
September 3, 2009 12:42AM
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Truth & the RCC, are you kidding?
The Roman Catholic Church has no interest in truth. No sincere investigator lacks the data to figure that out? The church that has hidden CENTURIES of pedophiles under it's skirts, has no integrity.
This is a cult that sells lies to desperate victims, then silences opposition by whatever means they have the power to employ at the time. Since they can no longer burn "heretics" at the state, they will use any threat, slander or extortion available.
How can this be news to anyone?
"Show me on the doll where Jesus touched you..." and all the other jokes about these creeps, cover up worlds of pain and generations of lives ruined by conscienceless predators in purple robes... This church protects the scum of the earth. The do it everywhere the church has power and they have done it for centuries, not decades, as they would like people to believe.
- Joey Tranchina
December 12, 2009 4:34AM
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Satire.
Satire exaggerates. Are Penn & Teller being completely accurate? No Fair? Yes. The Catholic Church has taken the position that a husband that has contracted AIDS from a blood transfusion can not morally use a condom to protect his wife from also getting AIDS.
- mike1948
August 30, 2009 10:44PM
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To their credit
To their credit, the Catholic Church does permit the couple to avoid transferring AIDS by refraining from having sex.
- fsilber
September 2, 2009 12:51PM
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Big deal, they do that for everyone.
They even frown on child molestation these days. Give a cheer for Buddy Christ!
- Submariner September 2, 2009 11:54PM
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True story...jt
I once asked the Dean of Men at Loyola University: "How may fish to you think you would have to throw a seal before he gave you control over his dick?" Any man or woman who looks to these predators, parasites and panderers for his morals doesn't deserve to have sex .
- Joey Tranchina
December 12, 2009 4:55AM
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P and T doing what they do
So I watched the vid last night and it's a normal P and T episode, there was nothing in it that stood out. On the 10 scale for BS episodes, it maybe an eight. Now if your mission is "protecting catholicism " then of course you would be offended.
I won't spend much time commenting on how Catholics might feel about the Pope or Vatican being criticized. Frankly, I couldn't care how the Pope, the Vatican, or the Catholic League feel about it. Two out of three of those groups could disappear and the world would be a better place.
What I do find interesting is the group Dignity. Dignity is a group of gay Catholics. Now one might ask, "why in hell would a gay try and stay in the Catholic church "? Activism from the inside is the most powerful kind of activism, so I get the answer. But talk about a group of masochistic activists. I think it would be easier for a black man to join the klan. And while a bajillion people would disagree with me, I can't see the point in fighting that hard just to belong to another version of the same old mythology.
- tek August 31, 2009 7:02AM
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Nazi Analogy Overused
Is it just me or do Catholic groups throw around "Nazi" references way too often? This is hardly an issue to even think about making such a comparison.
Or maybe it's just that everyone in general does so. Quite ridiculous in my opinion.
- learnlogic
August 31, 2009 7:44AM
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Nazi's
are the new "Commies" buzzword to toss some fear about. It doesn't have to matter whether or not it has anything to do with what people are talking about. Just toss in the word " nazi " willy nilly and watch it take off like wildfire.
"Quite ridiculous in my opinion."
Quite ridiculous indeed.
- tek August 31, 2009 8:23AM
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Hmmm
Considering that the present Holy Father was a member of the Hitler Youth, I should think that bringing up the Nazis is a bit like mentioning rope in the house of a man who has been hanged. It's not as if everybody believe Pius XII did his all, either.
- ducdebrabant
September 2, 2009 3:21PM
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OMG!
Will someone PLEASE call the Waaambulance for Mr. Donohue! I think he's about to have a case of the crying fits!
Nazi reference? The Nazi regime was quite persistent in woo-ing Catholic approval, I don't think demonization of the Catholic Church would have been in their best interest, or in their interests at all. But conservatives have really found value in comparing any slight against them as a Nazi style attack. Isnt their a law of rhetoric about whomever brings up Hitler or the Nazi's first, loses?I guess we can throw that one out... Or can we?
- Rice klowN
August 31, 2009 8:23AM
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the law
to which you refer is called Godwin's law . You can find a whole article about it on wikipedia.
- cityboy
September 2, 2009 11:55AM
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Thank you
I remember reading it once, and then could never think of the name again. Thanks for the link.
- Submariner September 2, 2009 11:55PM
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Penn and Teller's way of making a point.
Penn and Teller are "scandalous" for a reason, they take a point of view and do something most are afraid to do.......express it publicly! They are showmen, so getting attention is their primary focus, and you have to admit, they're good at it. VERY good. As Penn stated early in the episode, they contacted Vatican officials and asked for comments, but got no reply. He then went on to say, the church has spent the past 2000 years making excuses for their behavior. I think the church should own up to some criticism, but the fact that they won't makes people mistrust them even more. They still follow the "do as I say, not as I do" policy that got them just where they are now. They're the ultimate secret society , yet they publicly frown upon secret societies.
The show was an attack on the Vatican, NOT Catholicism itself. Penn and Teller are admitted atheists , and know dedicating a show to denouncing RELIGION as BS would not go over well. They still have every right as Americans to stand up and say "Hey, we think this organization's actions are ridiculous!"
As far a the Nazi reference thrown around by the church, they should be careful. History shows the church was supportive of the Nazis, and never publicly denounced them during the war.
- GrandVisier
September 20, 2009 6:15PM
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Furious catholics?
.
So what's new? They're always furious about something, whatever that may be. It only proves the lack of Joy and contenment one experiences and enjoys in true Christianity; That is the Gospel. Mr. Donohue in complaining about Penn & Teller supposed lies. Forgets or completely ignores the teaching of Jesus about forgiveness. But of course then without missing a hitch, adds his own collection of lies. The main one being the worn out and ragged about the RCC being 2,000 years old. Of course Mr. Donohue et al in the RCC & the CLRCR are not required neither by Law or conscience to prove this or any other fatabulous allegations or dogmas of the RCC.
.
- Salero21
August 31, 2009 1:18PM
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News
In other news, Bill Donohue goes outside; is enraged by his own shadow.
- Ouabache
September 2, 2009 11:16AM
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So
Does that mean there will be 6 more weeks of winter? Damn!
- State of Reason
September 2, 2009 1:39PM
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The BIGGEST LIE of all
If Penn lied then file a lawsuit and the facts will rule.
It pales in comparison to the biggest lie of all: god exists
no evidence, merely personal experience is feigned as factual and yet the church marches on.
When it comes to lies, the religious are the last ones who ought to be casting stones.
Belief systems? no problem. no American who upholds freedom of religion would stop someone from "believing" anything they want; but let's have a big heaping spoonful of reality about who propagates lies.
BTW - the courts have already ruled on "god", otherwise known as " intelligent design " and that ruling didn't come out in your favor. I recall the judge called it, "breathtaking inanity" and HE was catholic.
- scooteraz
September 2, 2009 11:19AM
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"breathtaking inanity" in context
Jones didn't say ID or " god " is breathtaking inanity.
Jones' quote: "Those who disagree with our holding will likely mark it as the product of an activist judge. If so, they will have erred as this is manifestly not an activist Court. Rather, this case came to us as the result of the activism of an ill-informed faction on a school board, aided by a national public interest law firm eager to find a constitutional test case on ID, who in combination drove the Board to adopt an imprudent and ultimately unconstitutional policy. The breathtaking inanity of the Board's decision is evident when considered against the factual backdrop which has now been fully revealed through this trial. The students, parents, and teachers of the Dover Area School District deserved better than to be dragged into this legal maelstrom, with its resulting utter waste of monetary and personal resources."
- Screen Name
September 2, 2009 12:10PM
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Indeed
After having read transcripts & 40 days/40 nights, I agree with you - it looks as though you've quoted it correctly/exactly
my point was regarding the idea that ID is not science and therefore not proven that a " god " exists - which lends itself to the earlier comment - the biggest lie of all
for those who knew the case, the above explanation wasn't needed; for those like yourself, perhaps, more information was needed - thanks for providing it.
Cheers!
- scooteraz
September 2, 2009 12:16PM
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Arguments for and against the existence of "god"
Do you know about all the arguments for and against the existence of " god "?
http://www.freebase.com/view/en/god/-/base/argumentmaps
- Screen Name
September 2, 2009 12:52PM
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It's odd
The first thing I clicked on that site was the ULTIMATE 747 GAMBIT...because it sounded cool. The author made it clear that it only applies to an Abrahamic G-d who is a personal God and susceptible to worship. That...wasn't what Abraham said G-d was.
- quantummechanik September 2, 2009 1:04PM
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First Cause
I don't argue for or against existence. Do I know what the "first cause" was? No I do not and neither does anyone else - they only have conjecture, personal experience, agreed consensus (just like those pesky gorebal warming people I can't stand)
all anyone has is "personal experience" - no one has a scintilla of factual evidence.
as such, I do not argue existence for anyone can believe anything they desire.
I happen to believe in Santa Claus, he's jolly, is generous and doesn't discriminate for any reason.
there's no point in arguing or debating existence. science has a method of testing data over & over again seeking its own falsification - religion , by its nature, never thinks it's wrong - therein lies the problem - religion attempts to own righteousness.
ppl should enjoy their belief systems, but they carry no credential since they are personal & subjective; they have no protections against those who disagree & invoke their 1st Amendment free speech ; freedom of choice is upheld by any freedom loving American.
http://iconicfreedom.blogspot.com/2009/08/on-issues-religion-and-america-freedom.html
it's all about freedom or control - which side are Americans on?
- scooteraz
September 2, 2009 1:48PM
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First Cause Exists?
Are you saying a First Cause exists?
- Screen Name
September 2, 2009 3:21PM
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existence?
"Do I know what the "first cause" was? No I do not and neither does anyone else - they only have conjecture, personal experience..."
what exists is speculation; what is reality is what is observable
seems easy to understand, but when people desire to own something by which to control others, they will eventually attempt to define things so they get to control the outcomes
again, science offers falsification and religion just thinks it's 'right' - very funny when you think of it - really shows arrogance of those who would elevate themselves
- scooteraz
September 2, 2009 8:28PM
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There IS a God, but not the one you're thinking of.
The only TRUE God is the Flying Spaghetti Monster!
Show me an argument against the Flying Spaghetti Monster that PROVES he can't exist, and I'll make an argument that he's no more preposterous than any other God.
All praise His Noodliness!
RAMEN
- GrandVisier
September 20, 2009 6:34PM
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Church in America......
The church in America loves throwing around the "Separation of Church and State" as well as the whole "Freedom of Religion" arguments, however, they don't believe in it when you look at it. They have the right to believe what they believe, but if you disagree or hold other beliefs, you're just wrong and need to be "saved". The fact that they use the term "saved" in the context of making you believe the same way they do, shows just how intolerant they really are. Churches are the least tolerant people in the World, If you disagree with them, you'll burn in Hell for all eternity, you're guilty of Heresy, or (as George Carlin was fond of pointing out) you gotta go! More people have been killed in the name of God (whichever God it may be) throughout history, than for any other reason. The Vatican has been an active participant in most wars since it's founding, as have many other religious organizations.
Just remember, the Catholics are a Christian organization, a religion who finds it funny that the ancient people of the World believed in many Gods. A religious organization who has taken older religions, as well as religions that others still believe in deeply, and relegated them to mythology, and laugh at them as if they're children 's fairy tales. VERY tolerant. I guess those religions must have been just way too far fetched for anyone to really believe. Good thing the Christians gave us a religion that is more grounded. You know, the religion based on an invisible man in the clouds who knocked up a virgin who gave birth to a son who could walk on water and survive death, only to mysteriously float up into the clouds.
Oh......and he should be back from that any day now.......
- GrandVisier
September 20, 2009 6:30PM
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Nazism again?
I think there should be a policy that any argument that references Nazis in a comparative fashion should be automatically disregarded. Its a sloppy debate technique devoid from the point, but serving only to enflame emotions.
Sorry, you lost me at National Socialism.
That all being said; I challenge Mr. Donohue to show that the Catholic church has NOT suffered from “intolerance, greed, paranoia, hypocrisy and callous disregard for human suffering” at its highest levels.
I also find it interesting that CATHOLICS for Choice is listed here as an anti-Catholic group.
- lasher42
September 2, 2009 11:23AM
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"On Monday, we will have a mass mailing of DVD copies"
That is FANTASTIC. Piracy for Jesus?
Yes, I believe Jesus absolutely supports theft of copyrighted intellectual property!
- locavore September 2, 2009 11:37AM
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He was called
as a witness at the Pirate Bay trial.
Never showed though.
- quantummechanik September 2, 2009 12:18PM
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What spin!
Cardinal Ratzinger did create the edict mentioned and he did receive diplomatic immunity here in the US for his involvement.
The show was pretty spot on. Of course any Catholic won't want to accept that and they'll get annoyed, but tough. Of course they have the right to say they're annoyed, just as Penn & Teller had the right to say what they said in their show. That's how free speech works. People like Donohue and the Catholic League need to come to terms with that, among other things.
YouMadeMeSayIt.com
- PhillyChief
September 2, 2009 11:38AM
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surprising
While P&T present documented evidence and talk to the people involved, the authors of this dreadful article dismiss all of it by just labelling it as lies. When they present interviews with the person who was arrested for making comments about the pope , it's kind of hard to deny it without looking like a monty python sketch.
I have zero respect for the pope or the catholic church , mostly because of all the evil they have promulgated in the world. His recent statements blaming atheists for global warming are hilarious - he says the behavior of people who are separated from the sky ghost seek ever-more material possessions, and that is driving global warming. Material Possessions. This coming from the guy sitting on top of mountains of gold and artworks and living in a marble palace. If there was a god to be on his side, much less speaking directly into his ear, he wouldn't really need a bullet-proof car, would he?
- cityboy
September 2, 2009 11:50AM
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Grow up
Penn & Teller pull no punches. They have targeted a couple of my cherished delusions as well, but they are always truthful. I can either throw a tantrum like a spoiled brat (and like the writer of this article), or I can step outside myself and critically examine my beliefs. Those beliefs which are flawed need to be tossed away. That is the right answer.
- KentMcManigal September 2, 2009 12:09PM
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Cry me a river
Yeah, poor Catholics. Persecuted and oppressed. They don't even have a lobbyist group set up to attack any hint of criticism of their religion .. oh, wait...
Cry me a river. You reap what you sow. Stop acting like bigoted, lying crybabies, and P&T may leave you alone in the future.
- WayOfTheDodo September 2, 2009 12:23PM
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Penn & Teller
Amoral and power hungry? I though they were talking about the Obama administration and Congressional Democrats. Now that you mention it though,,,,,
- edweirdness
September 2, 2009 12:34PM
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kinda sad
While I think the Catholic Church is over-reacting, it is also sad to see P and T using their show as a pedestal to attack what they hate.
They're both right. And I have to lean towards the Church when I say that they are more right.
But they both have the right to say what they want about each other. Even if one is just being a pompous couple of dickheads, and the other is being a whiny bitch about it.
- camosoul77
September 2, 2009 1:28PM
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Benedict had his say, though
I do seem to recall Benedict, while still a cardinal, blaming the priest-pedophile scandal on the larger American society -- something about us being such corrupt hedonists that even American priests are infected into doing what they wouldn't otherwise do. This was before a similar scandal was uncovered in Ireland. I don't believe he has explained how American society so fully infected the priesthood in Ireland.
- ducdebrabant
September 2, 2009 3:27PM
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Nazis? 6 million jews versus 1 TV show...
I loved Bill Donohue's comparison of P+T with the nazis! The most striking thing about the nazis was the sheer volume of people they killed because of their religion - so if we're looking for real comparisons, who else in history ever put hordes of people to death on religious grounds? Interestingly, you never hear people like Bill Donohue complaining about a "Crusade" being waged against them.
- Mark D
September 2, 2009 6:22PM
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People vs. Abstracts
Certainly, those who call themselves "catholic", the people themselves, deserve respect no matter how irrational their thinking and practices. What doesn't deserve respect and never ought to lest one savage throw out the importance of accurate observation and logical reason are the abstract concepts behind catholicism or any other irrational religion . Note that I call it "irrational religion" because there are indeed religions that are entirely rational.
Respect the human being for doing the best they are currenlty able, but NEVER respect poor observation or poor thinking or the practices and institutions leading from it. To do so is to betray that which leads to genuine knowledge, genuine wisdom, genuine human progress from savage idiocy to civilized enlightenment, i.e., accurate observation and logical reasoning.
- Naumadd
September 2, 2009 11:32PM
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What was Penn & Teller talking about?
Don't know what Penn & Teller were talking about. Atheist Soviets killed 45 million people in the Gulags. Atheist Chinese Communists slaughtered over 60 million. How many did that Cambodian atheist Pol Pot kill? Oh, how many people died thanks to the atheists who rose to power during the French revolution? Gosh! I think the catholics look like amateurs in comparison. Don't you?
Maybe one person's genocide IS another's liberation. With that in mind, perhaps the crusaders were justified when they went into Jerusalem after when the Fatimid Caliph al-Hakim bi-Amr Allah ordered the slaughter of thousands of Christian pilgrims & the destruction of the Church of the Holy Sepulcher. Perhaps the muslims were justified in killing 3,000 office workers on 9/11 or slaughtering all those Armenians.
And one more thing, Hitler youth was mandatory for every German child of Ratzinger's generation so I don't think that automatically makes him a Nazi (who were pagans & occultists).
I am not a Catholic but I just can't stomach this kind of hypocrisy & bigotry coming from Penn & Teller. Clean your own house before you say something about someone else.
- whatHistory
September 3, 2009 12:53AM
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irishcoonass
Nothing could please a satiric comedian more than watching the object of his chain-pulling attempt to explain away the charges.
- irish coonass
September 3, 2009 7:30AM
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priestcraft in the modern world
I continue to be amazed at how priestcraft can be taken seriously in the modern world.
The belief that a cosmic jewish zombie (who is his own father) can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and drink his blood, while telepathically telling him that you accept him as your master, so that he can remove an evil force from your 'soul' that is present in all humanity because a woman (made out of one rib and some dirt) was tricked into eating fruit from a magic tree by a talking snake. And millions still buy that crap!
As Sagan said, "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." There is absolutely none for any religious belief! Sheep is a apt term for followers of any religion .
- liquidbread
September 3, 2009 7:51PM
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penn and teller
The Church can say anything about me going to hell etc, but they cannot take any criticism.
Read about the Vatican it will make your blood boil the goings on there.
If you cant take the heat dont start the fire.
Keep it up Penn and Teller .
- beinghuman
September 4, 2009 6:40AM
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Bill Donohue is a media clown...jt
It is a bad headline that begins: "Catholics Furious" then focuses on Bill Donohue. Donohue does not represent most Roman Catholics or much of anything else, he is a fanatic and a Vatican ass-kisser,. who fits right in with an authoritarian pope , This Benedict may have rejected the Hitler Jugen experience of his youth but that experience, obviously, shaped the personality of the former head of "the Inquisition," which in the 20th century is a sick joke.
This faux representative of American Catholic opinion should be more careful about using Nazi accusations for that presumes ignorance of his church 's complicity in the crimes of the Third Reich.
Bill Donohue is a disgusting man, who I would only appoint as spokesman for a cause that I despised. He speaks for the power of a cult that does not much exist in the first world, but is gaining power and influence in the third because, frankly, ignorance is one of the requisites for faith in lies.
- Joey Tranchina
December 12, 2009 4:38AM
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Voltaire knew than...jt
When Voltaire was dying and a Catholic priest admonished him to: "Renounce the Devil and all his works" he replied: "This is no time to be making new enemies."
Humor is the strongest defense against the preposterous nonsense of Roman Catholicism as well as the other repulsive Fundamentalist cults.
These parasites have no power over people who are not terrified by death or fairy tales. Life is short enough, why waste it with lies?
- Joey Tranchina
December 12, 2009 4:50AM
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