Ron Paul-"Warmongering" On Iran Sounds Like Lead-Up to Iraq War

(Video) Ron Paul-"Warmongering" On Iran Sounds Like Lead-Up to Iraq War

By Opposing Views Editorial Staff

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Regarding Comment
Yes, we need more war...
  • quantummechanik
    "Our people"

    Man, the antisemitism continues with you.

    Jewish death isn't something you're willing to commit military resources to because any Jewish death is their own fault for being there in the first place.

    - quantummechanikUS October 1, 2009 3:37PM

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    • Submariner
      What do WE mean "our" people?

      Your use of "antisemitism" attribution to defend your complete lack of objectivity is a betrayal of the innocent victims of actual antisemism. You should be ashamed.

      If it is unduly disciminative to be against going to war for another country without just cause, then so be it.

      Frankly, I would be fine if everyone in Israel came to live with me if it ends all the constant strife it's presence causes, and removed the single most likely cause of the next nuclear attack that might occur.

      Israel is a nation - it loses its race card when it can't help but attack US Navy ships and Palestinian children alike.

      Get a clue before you try to put words in my mouth. I am not afraid of your pandering. The OP may be, but I doubt it. I don't believe in God and I see no reason for Israel to pick the path of most resistance, but that is extent of my antisemitism. You might as well call it Athiesm with a flare for not killing lots of innocent's.

      I ask again, why do you not let "G-d" sort it out? See how far that get's you.

      - Submariner October 1, 2009 6:03PM

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      • quantummechanik
        Where exactly do you live

        That YOUR people didn't take from someone else, out of curiousity? It's funny that an awful lot of european-descended Americans rail against what they see as an occupation.

        You want to know what the path of most resistance is? Going back to diaspora, where the Jews have to live seperated and without a homeland. In EVERY country that we've settled in, we've been either driven out or eliminated. Saying "That didn't happen" is anti-semitic, and idiotic. Saying "They deserve it" is anti-semitic, and idiotic. Saying "They still shouldn't have a homeland, they don't deserve the safety of that" is anti-semitic and idiotic. Which of these things are you saying?

        - quantummechanikUS October 2, 2009 10:38AM

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        • Submariner
          Hawaii, actually. It's nice this time of millennia...

          And I'm mostly Native American, Native British Isles, and a couple generations in Texas, so please don't think I only rail against Israeli occupation. I also rail against Anglo-Saxon occupation in Scotland, European occupation in the America's, and government occupation in Texas.

          I am not saying anything like that. That's why I percieved a strayman in your accusation. So what am I saying?

          I am saying that your "They" is not really a hollistic view of the Hebrew people. Israel is a nation, a member of non proliferation (which Iran is not), and a military force opposed to most of their neighbors and even some of their inhabitants. How may Jew's live elsewhere in the world without having to deal with suicide bombers or without having to blow up children with tanks and helicopters?

          I am saying that Israel as it is now known was predicated on a very liberal high ground but executes it's soveriegnty with a might-makes-right philosophy. And it does so mostly on the charity of the US tax payer and if this were not absolutely the case, they would not have one of the largest lobbies in the US.

          I am saying any position that motivates people in cities to kill innocent people constantly is not defensible. The humans rights violations and obstruction of the press and justice itself throughout the middle east is at a peak in occupied area's in Israel. "He hit me first" is not a satisfactory explanation for this situation.

          I am saying that Ron Paul should be able to speak out against warmongering without being labelled an antisemitic (not saying you have done so, but it is happening). People are cautioned or restrained from questioning our roles in the middle east whenever it's not favorable to Israel. The fact is there is at least as much cause for the Iranian PEOPLE to despise western influence as we have cause to despise the Iranian government's policies.

          And I am saying that the religious conflict is the most flagrant aspect of our civilizations social and technological adolescence. People are posturing to wipe each other out over their imaginary friends and fear of the psychological rapists that peddle them. There is no Holy Land for any one People.

          What there is, is a world we all must share that is in constant threat of annihilation for petty nonsense.

          We should not be willing to tolerate that. And we should be able to discuss it without being arbitrarily demonized, especially out of hypocrisy.

          - Submariner October 2, 2009 4:50PM

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          • quantummechanik
            The Jews of the world

            are as under siege as any of them in Israel--not as directly, but even a cursory glance at history will show time and time again what happens to Jews. Israel isn't about the Palestinians vs. the Israelis, it's about the world vs. the Jewish people. Outside of Israel, we also have to deal with terrorist attacks in our community centers and temples, attacks in the street, etc.

            The concept of Israel as a military force acting in opposition to the other countries of the region is once again a very narrow viewpoint. Of course right now they've got a massive military presence on all borders--people keep attacking them. And they don't attack them on the basis of border disputes, or philosophical differences. This isn't in any sense a traditional war, where one is trying to gain enough ground and stop. The goal is, and always has been, "Drive the Jews into the Sea."

            Do you believe that Hitler REALLY only cared about purifying his own country of Jewry, that he wasn't at all interested in a global solution? Do you think that pogroms on Russian villages were all unrelated? Such as it is with the war in the middle east . One side isn't fighting for ground--It's fighting for the complete destruction of the other side. The IDF isn't fighting for territory, it's fighting for survival. And as we see with attacks within the US and Canada, they are trying to kill all of us, everywhere.

            As for human rights and press supression, perhaps examine North Korea.

            - quantummechanikUS October 3, 2009 10:24AM

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            • Submariner
              Signal to Noise ratio getting low...

              First of all, according to a number of multilateral NGO's we all know and love, Israel is pretty bad for human rights violations for quite some time, and its the worst of all US backed nations, unless you count Walmart as backing, and then its China, then Israel. So please explain why Israel is special amongst countries dealing with external and internal stryfe.

              Second of all, even with an extremely disproportionate coverage, it is very easy to find out why it might be easy for Israel's enemies to vilify them. Foremost is probably the huge numbers of civilian casualties cause by Israel. From 4 to 10 times as many as they suffer, depending on which recently freed from Israeli prison and/or not publicly stifled journalist or investigator you talk to.

              Third, you should know, Hitler is dead. The third reich ended almost 60 years ago. Since then Israel has been at WAR with most of its neighbors and it does not get to play victim from a position of military superiority backed by big brother.

              Fourth, the idea that they are not fighting for ground or territory is purely fiction. It is the expansion they get the most criticism for other than blowing up children and RPGing journalists in the face. The lack of objectivity here is astonishing.

              Fifth, I am not sure what attacks there have been on Canada, but America's antagonism to sources of terror elements is not blameless. Aside from it's unilateral support for Isreal, the crap we have pulled in Iraq, and Iran, as well as the exploitation of most of the Middle East by western business, has all gone a long way to teasing these rat's to madness.

              So, after 3 paragraphs and a mutterance, you seem to suggest the idea that 'North Korea is more f'd up than Israel so what do I have to complain about?' Not only is this pathetic, but its a horrible comparison to make anyway. It really just augments the idea that people are not being objective.

              I ask again, why are you content to let "G-d" figure it out for the Holy Land?

              - Submariner October 4, 2009 10:28PM

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              • quantummechanik
                There is something wrong with you

                if, when you see a group faced with genocide, snidely ask them "Where's your G-d now?" You've rotated from antisemitically superior to happy these people are dying.

                Which NGO's are you talking about? The UNHRC, that Kofi Anan and Ban Ki-Moon keep criticizing? Amnesty International, where Israel ranks behind the US for amount of press releases, and behind Turkey for violation reports, and once again is massively biased towards countries that are fully industrialized, as is Human Rights Watch?
                Here you go, Reporters without borders:
                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Press_Freedom_Index
                Israel ranked higher than Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, and Palestine. And that's where there is a war. If we look at Israel proper, it's almost as high in the US.


                Yes, that's what we do. We habitually stifle news reports and imprison reporters because, you know, we're Jews. We lie. If you want to talk about prisons , examine the latest release of 20 women in a prisoner exchange. We got a video of a guy captured 3 years ago, by the way, for those prisoners. The women, who completed high school equivalency degrees and trade school training while in prison and were visited regularly by families, were immediately denounced as having an Israeli GPS chip implanted in their breast, the better to "bomb their families while they slept" in retaliation. As for our guy, the guy in the video? Hamas doesn't let the Red Cross in to see what prisons are like. So you tell me which has the human rights violations.

                You know why the civilian casualties are so high when the amount of firepower is roughly the same, over the course of any given conflict? It's because we drill for this. Israel's built like a bunker--every building is reinforced against rocket and mortar attacks. We get inside as fast as humanly possible. No one seems interested in funding the Palestinians--Probably fair enough, since they have the habit of killing non-Palestinian Arabs for..walking around, basically.

                Oh, Hitler is dead, so the Jews are safe now. Hooray! That is the single stupidest thing I have ever heard on this site, ever. Slavery is over, so blacks and whites are now equal! Women have the right to vote , so sexism is gone and dead! What the hell is wrong with you that you don't know, or care, about the enormous amount of European, American and Middle Eastern antisemitism that still exists, FATALLY, and feel comfortable enough saying that the Jewish people are now safe. We have death threats, temples are regularly defaced, there are attacks outside temples on holidays, and of course the occasional shooter who wanders into the JCC and opens up. The Protocols of the Elders of Zion are being handed out in Japan, and Indian managerial students are reading Mein Kampf to learn organizational techniques. But Hitler's dead, so, you know, we're good.

                Borders change after wars. That's how the entire world has worked for pretty much ever. No one seems to complain when it's Europeans. As for the expansion? We were attacked. We can drive people back as much as we humanly can, until we feel safe. When a man attacks you in your home, are you content to simply fight him off to the doorway and then give up? Especially when he vows again and again to keep trying?

                - quantummechanikUS October 5, 2009 10:59AM

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