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In response
clarification of the request for a logical basis
You have certainly been very civil in this discussion. This is by far the most interesting conversation I have had with an atheist on this topic. I would like to focus on your first point.
You have described your basis for morality and explained reasons why it is important. I basically agree with what you said there. What I was actually asking for was how you derived this from an atheistic worldview. I assume that you believe in the popular modern origins myth, evolution . In this view the world and all life came into existence through unguided (from an intelligence standpoint) physical processes. Among other things, this provides no explanation for many abstract and non-material concepts/phenomena that exist today. For example, your response implies to me that you value life and relationships. Why? It is true that life is more pleasant if everyone shows respect for each other. Within an atheistic viewpoint, why should this phenomenon occur? How can physical process account for the origin of abstract things such as value, compassion, human emotion, or even conscious thought?
The world around us makes far more sense to me within a biblical framework. For example, the Bible reveals the plural (triune) nature of God. From the first verse in Genesis the plural noun for God (Elohim) is used with a verb that takes a singular subject. It would be like saying in English “They creates.” You might think, so what? It implies that God in inherently relational. He has always existed in harmonious relationship with himself. The created world reflects this relational aspect of its Creator. For example, this is why symbiosis is so prevalent, and even necessary, for life on earth. This is why respect matters and “do no harm” makes sense. The biblical worldview also explains why relationships often don’t work (Genesis 3) as well as giving the solution to the problem. It explains why God went to such extreme measures to restore the broken relationship between Him and mankind. It also explains why even those who don’t acknowledge God can have some intuitive sense of right and wrong; God has written His law on their hearts (Romans 2:14-15). A major reason I embrace a biblical worldview is because I find it logically consistent with reality.
I would be interested in hearing any further thoughts you have on this.
- seektruth
June 27, 2009 11:02AM
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Please be patient
on my response. I thank you for continuing to push my thinking on this subject matter. This thread has caused me to think far more deeply on this subject than I have ever needed to. I very much wish to carry on our dialog, but it is leaving the more "philosophical" and heading for the need for science , and not just reason.
In our line of discussion, I have found myself with the desire to answer in scientific terms:
What is the brain center for school pride?
What is the brain center for religious thought?
Why do we become sports "fans" and have an allegiance to a team that we have no financial or familiar investment?
Why do we care, and indeed, why are we even emotional at all?
In many areas of our lives we exhibit different passions and compassions, and even mores. So for me to fairly treat your last response, I am left to come up with something more than just my opinion. You have me at disadvantage at the moment. You have the Bible to resort to on these matters. I have no desire to dissect either the Bible or religion , and wish to only answer your questions from my "side" of the aisle.
Thank you for your patience, and I will develop my response as quickly as my research allows.
- tek June 28, 2009 8:42PM
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