This Is Torture?
By Jacob Laskin
The Obama administration got one thing right – and a great deal wrong – with its release last week of the so-called “interrogation memos,” a series of legal documents produced by the Bush-era Office of Legal Counsel and detailing some of the harsher interrogation methods used by the CIA against high-level al-Qaeda operatives.
To its credit, the administration vetoed the possibility of legal prosecution for either the memos’ Justice Department authors or the CIA personnel who conducted the interrogations, rejecting appeals from the anti-anti-terror Left, most prominently the ACLU, which had sued for the memos’ release. Despite a backlash from its partisan base, the administration has stood firm on that decision, with White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel being only the latest figure to affirm that the administration will not be pursuing the “retribution” that many of its supporters demand.
Nevertheless, the administration erred in releasing the memos. The reason has been most compellingly stated by former CIA director Michael Hayden. Hayden points out that disclosing details of U.S. interrogation tactics will only allow terrorist suspects to resist intelligence questioning in the future by revealing “the outer limits that any American would ever go in terms of interrogating an al-Qaeda terrorist.” Hayden’s argument holds true even if the tactics described in the memos are no longer used, and even if, as the administration argues, many of the details had previously been made public in reports on detainee treatment by the Red Cross. Interrogation techniques are effective only to the extent that they confound a detainee’s expectations about the kinds of treatment he may receive. By revealing the precise boundaries of that treatment, and by making them official, the administration has made al-Qaeda’s job that much easier.
The administration’s other mistake was to endorse the view, promulgated by the Left, that the techniques described in the memos deserve to be called “torture.” Even a cursory examination indicates otherwise. Indeed, so far from being “brutal,” as the New York Times has reported, most of the interrogation techniques are remarkable in their mildness. That is why all of the techniques described in the memos – with the exception of one innovative tactic involving an insect – were also used on some members of the military during their survival (Survival Evasion Resistance Escape) training. Far from being licensed to abuse detainees, moreover, CIA interrogators were instructed to make sure that their tactics never caused serious physical or even mental harm – even though their subjects were hardened terrorists avowedly committed to killing as many Americans as possible.
Take the insect “torture.” Specifically designed for al-Qaeda operative Abu Zubaydah, a confidant of Osama bin Laden’s with a fear of spiders, it involved placing Zubaydah in a “cramped confinement box” with an ostensibly stinging insect. Except that the insect would actually be harmless caterpillar. No physical harm whatsoever was meant to come to Zubaydah himself and, in any case, the tactic was never used. As evidence of “torture,” this is far from compelling.
One interrogation technique that was used is sleep deprivation. Importantly, however, the memos reveal that the emphasis was always two-fold: to obtain intelligence and cooperation but only insofar as no lasting physical or mental harm came to the detainee. To that end, they stipulate that if the detainee were to be denied sleep then “personnel with medical training” had to be available to intervene “in the unlikely event of an abnormal reaction.”
Even greater precautions were taken as part of a tactic called “walling.” In this technique, interrogators grab a detainee and slam him into a wall. That may sound brutal in theory, but in practice it was anything but. The wall into which subjects would be slammed, for instance, was to be “a flexible false wall.” In addition, the memos explain that when an individual hits the wall, “the head and neck are supported with a rolled hood or towel that provides a c-collar effect to help prevent whiplash.” The effectiveness of walling was not in the physical impact, which was minimal, but rather in the intimidating sound that the detainee would hear upon hitting the (again, fake) wall.
It should be noted that some have challenged the memos’ description of walling, pointing to a Red Cross report that cites the claims of Zubaydah, admitted 9-11 “mastermind” Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, as well as other al-Qaeda operatives, that they were directly slammed into a hard concrete wall. But even if the Red Cross report is to be believed – a big if, given that terrorist captives are trained to exaggerate their mistreatment by the U.S. – the fact remains that all admit to wearing a protective collar at the time of this alleged abuse. Even if they exceeded their prescribed authority – a point that is, as noted, by no means proven – CIA interrogators still went out of their way to minimize the physical harm that al-Qaeda operatives endured. If the intent was truly to “torture” these detainees, it’s hard to see why interrogators repeatedly tried to avoid inflicting serious harm.
This inconsistency may explain the obsessive focus with the most controversial of the interrogation techniques used, waterboarding, which entails placing an individual on an inclined bench, covering his forehead and eyes with cloth, and saturating the cloth with water for up to 40 seconds to simulate drowning. Particular outrage has greeted this week’s revelation that the CIA waterboarded two al-Qaeda operatives – Zubaydah and Khalid Sheikh Mohammed – a total of 266 times. By all accounts, waterboarding, which was used on only three detainees, is an intensely unpleasant procedure, and reasonable people can disagree about the legitimacy of its now-suspended use by the United States. But several points are worth bearing in mind.
First, as with other government-approved interrogation tactics, waterboarding was carefully monitored to avoid causing severe physical and mental harm. The procedure was not to last beyond 20 minutes at a time, and medical experts were required to be present throughout. In Zubaydah’s case, special care was taken to prevent physical injury, because at the time of his interrogation the al-Qaeda lieutenant was nursing a wound – sustained while fighting against U.S. troops in Pakistan – that his interrogators did not want to exacerbate.
Second, waterboading seems to have been effective, yielding vital intelligence in the War on Terror. According to ex-CIA chief Michael Hayden, Zubaydah revealed critical intelligence information – such as details that led to the capture of senior al-Qaeda agent Ramzi Binalshibh – only after interrogators began using techniques like waterboarding. The same was true for Khalid Shiekh Mohammed (KSM). A May 30, 2005 memo notes that as a result of interrogation techniques like waterboarding, KSM revealed information that led to the discovery of a terrorist plot to crash a hijacked airliner into a Los Angeles building, the disruption of a 17-member Indonesian terrorist cell, and the capture of an Indonesian terrorist and al-Qaeda liaison known as Hambali, among other successes. More broadly, the memo points out that thanks to enhanced interrogation techniques, “KSM and Zubaydah have been pivotal sources because of their ability and willingness to provide their analysis and speculation about the capabilities, methodologies and mindsets of terrorists” (emphasis added). Not surprisingly, the memo reports that the CIA viewed these techniques as “indispensable” to the task of uncovering “actionable intelligence” on terrorist organizations.
It’s hard to overstate the significance of that last fact. The same documents now being denounced as proof of American “torture” represent the U.S. government and the CIA’s best efforts to prevent the repeat of a devastating attack that killed 3,000 Americans. It’s a shame that the Obama administration has chosen to portray those efforts – undertaken with studied caution and a powerful awareness of the consequences of failure – as a betrayal of American ideals. What these officials have received is political absolution for a crime they did not commit. What they deserve is profound thanks for keeping the country safe.

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The USA used much worse tortures than water boarding in various countries around the world, including Egypt, Thailand, Diego Garcia, Qatar, Algeria, Romania and Poland to name just a few. Tortures included cutting gentals with razor blades and also electric shocks.
If you torture anyone all they will do is tell you anything you want to hear just to put an end to their inhuman treatment. USA trains torturers for the whole of Latin America at Fort Benning and then arrest and maltreat Russian reporters who report on a demonstration against this torture school.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z2pN-QfNuM
Oh boy this debate is exciting. It's giving a good chance for me to observe how far can stupidity go. Did US torture ha? When are we going to see a debate about "is the world flat?" or "is the world center of solar system?". What's even more pathetic is that those say "no" trying to defend their opinion by pointing Saddam's torture chambers. Wow! Have you ever heard a term named "non sequitur"? How can does it mean that US didn't torture because Saddam had torture chambers?
I'm sorry folks but waterboarding , sensory deprivation, exposure to freezing temperatures, being held in a darkened cell with music blaring 24 hours a day is not torture , it is damn uncomfortable, and distracting but it's not torture.
I was waterboarded in SERE School when I was in the military . It makes you think you are going to suffocate or drown, but you don't die, but you think you will die. This is just reasonable and humane techniques used to obtain needed information. The liberals among us are the enemy, they want America to fail, they call these techniques "torture", again they resort to lies and fraudulent statements to try and make America look bad to the world. Frankly I don't give a damn, if it works, do it. What we do is not torture, what they did to David Pearl and others is torture, just ask David! Oh I forgot they cut his head off we can't ask him. Stupid liberals.
I too am a SERE graduate and know that what was done to these guys is nowhere near torture . If some of these folks would talk to actual POW's - that Prisoners Of War, legal combatants who in fact ARE protected by the Geneva Conventions - and then talked to these detainees, they would laugh at what is being called torture. Those poor, poor babies got their faces wet. Cry me a river while you defend those cowards.
Thank you for your service but I find your views quite anti-American.
If Special Operator defines a technique that makes 'you think you will die' as 'humane', then I would hate to see what he thinks is inhumane.
LagerHead: The difference between being waterboarded as a training exercise and in real life is massive. The trainee knows it's going to stop before he dies . The real life detainee doesn't.
America used to stand for freedom, justice and the rule of law . These values seemed to be discarded during the Bush years, where America became, in the eyes of most of the rest of the world, an arrogant, greedy, stupid bully. America's liberals - far from being the enemy - are working hard to restore America's lost standing in the community of nations.
Torturing people for fun is not American and it's not patriotic.
First, when you graduate SERE school you can come talk to me about a "training exercise ." It's one of the most realistic schools offered by the U.S. Military. The lengths they go to in order to create an ultra realistic training environment would leave most outsiders troubled at the treatment bestowed on American soldiers by other American soldiers.
Second, if apologizing to the rest of the world for every little perceived misdeed is what you consider restoring "America's lost standing," well then I'll keep our lost standing.
No country in the history of the world has done as much to restore freedom to other nations. No country has even come close, so forgive me if I don't feel like a heaping dose of the Obama Apology Tour '09 is in order.
Finally, until you agree that waterboarding , the worst treatment that can be shown to have bestowed upon the unlawful combatants who are not protected by the Geneva Conventions in the first place, is not torture , I'm afraid we are at an impasse.
And don't ever presume to call me anti-American or unpatriotic. It just shows that you know ZERO about me. You never will, so I can guess that you are at least bright enough to know where you can stick it.
Sincerely,
LagerHead.
I don't think anyone is asking you (or the US) to apolgise for the US's 'every little perceived misdeed' but we could start by stopping invading countries on false pretences and torturing people. By doing these things, and others like it (from using the State Department to bully poor countries into buying American tobacco products to refusing to act on climate change ) Bush's America lost its moral superiority and became part of the problem.
Incidentally I was calling your views anti-American, not you. This apparent dichotomy arises because the right wing in the US appears to have hijacked and distorted the values of patriotism (see George Lakoff's book The Political Mind). Within this worldview, being a good American seems to have morphed from being honest, decent, liberal and good to some kind of chest-thumping, my-country-right-or-wrong, badass warmonger.
Your views, which support the torture of some enemy combatants and the US's implied right to invade countries to 'restore democracy ' are, I believe, antithetical to 'real' American values of freedom, justice and the rule of law . The irony is that what you see as patriotic I see as an erosion of what America really stands for. I would be interested to hear your argument as to why a willingness to torture constitutes a patriotic act.
Re: your belief that past good deeds forgive present misdeeds, I disagree. If I gave you a $100 in 2000, would that entitle me to steal $100, or $1,000 from you in 2010? Of course not. Each act needs to be evaluated individually and independently on its own merits.
In any case, the assumption that America is the best and that the rest of the world wants to be like you is a bit naive and patronising. One fine example of this would be the belief that US troops would be welcomed as liberators by the Iraqis. Who said it was/is America's job to 'restore freedom' to other nations'? Boy, what a can of worms that one is...
Can you please point out which of my views specifically is anti-American? Because all of my views reflect me, and if my view are anti-American, than I must be too. Is it because I disagree with the liberal point of view? Last time I checked there were people who were plenty American with liberal and conservative views, and everything in between. Or maybe because I don't think having water poured on your face is torture ? Again, the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America guarantees me that right. So if anything, I'm uber-American. And I like how you equate liberal and good, as if everything conservative is evil. Nice.
"Re: your belief that past good deeds forgive present misdeeds, I disagree."
Never said that. But what I did say was true.
"In any case, the assumption that America is the best and that the rest of the world wants to be like you is a bit naive and patronising."
Actually it's not. American pop culture sells everywhere. And America has millions of immigrants entering this country every year, both legally and illegally. Must be because it's such a cesspool, right? Of course I never actually said that America was the best either, but now that you bring it up, I do think it's damn hard to beat. I've been to lots of other countries, even ones I can't wait to visit again. But I wouldn't take one of them over the one in which I live, and served.
You say that the training is ultra-realistic and that waterboarding is not torture , although you do not present any evidence to support your claim. That's your opinion and you are entitled to it, but I wonder if you'd feel the same if you were being waterboarded by the CIA rather than by SERE trainers.
The difference between the two is noted by the DoJ. According to a Justice Department memo which references a report of the CIA Inspector General on the their use of waterboarding, the CIA waterboards detainees "in a different manner" than the technique used by SERE:
"The difference was in the manner in which the detainees' breathing was obstructed. At the SERE school and in the DoJ opinion, the subject's airflow is disrupted by the firm application of a damp cloth over the air passages; the interrogator applies a small amount of water to the cloth in a controlled manner. By contrast, the Agency interrogator ... applied large volumes of water to a cloth that covered the detainee's mouth and nose. One of the psychiatrist / interrogators acknowledged that the Agency's use of the technique is different from that used in SERE training because it is 'for real' and is more poignant and convincing."
According to the same memo, the CIA's Office of Medical Services (OMS) stated that "the experience of the SERE psychologist / interrogators on the waterboard was probably misrepresented at the time, as the SERE waterboard experience is so different from the subsequent Agency usage as to make it almost irrelevant" and that "[c]onsequently, according to OMS, there was no a priori reason to believe that applying the waterboard with the frequency and intensity with which it was used by the psychologist/interrogators was either efficacious or medically safe ."
So the CIA, who actually did the waterboarding, disagrees with you. They (and the DoJ) say that SERE waterboarding and 'real' waterboarding are substantially different. If, as you say the 'ultra realistic training environment would leave most outsiders troubled at the treatment bestowed on American soldiers by other American soldiers', one dreads to think how a recipient of 'real life' CIA waterboarding would feel.
To argue that this is not torture is disingenuous. Waterboarding is considered a form of torture by legal experts (to see a list of over 100 US law professors who define it as such, visit http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2006/04/05/open-letter-attorney-general-alberto-gonzales ), politicians, war veterans (including Sen McCain), medical experts in the treatment of torture victims, intelligence officials (see Stephen Grey's Ghost Plane: the true story of the CIA torture program), military judges ( http://crooksandliars.com/2007/11/03/retired-jags-send-letter-to-leahy-waterboarding-is-inhumane-it-is-torture-and-it-is-illegal /) and human rights organizations.
It is interesting that the only people who seem to think it's not torture are some of the people who are doing it (what a surprise!). Everyone else sees it for what it really is. As one former CIA official, once a senior official for the directorate of operations, said: 'Of course it was torture.'
I address your other points below....
Well folks, there you have it. Dude looks up some stuff on the Internet and that means that what I saw, I didn't see; what I experienced, I didn't experience.
But wait. Could there be something left out? For example, could it be that maybe, just maybe, you can't believe EVERYTHING the government tells you, even a liberal one? Nah, couldn't be. Or could it be that some of the tactics and techniques are classified and therefore not public knowledge. No, that couldn't be either.
Hate to break it to you, but a wet washcloth is FAR from the worst treatment at SERE school . That's why some people don't graduate. That's also why the soldiers who are detailed to play the part of guards (in other words, not actually being trained, but just filling in as "extras") often require psychological counseling afterward. But don't take my word for it: Teapot found some stuff on the Interwebs, so that settles it.
Is all information from the internet not allowed, or just some?
No-one is disputing what you saw or experienced. Just your interpetation of whether or not waterboarding constitutes torture , which is the topic under discussion here.
As you say, maybe the government is lying, maybe some tactics are top secret...then again, maybe not. We need evidence, not unsupported accusations.
I don't really care what the US military does to its employees at SERE, it's what they're doing to detainees in real life that is at debate here. With respect, that the US military does a version of this to its own people that is so severe that the trainers need psychological counselling is a not particularly good argument that this does not constitute torture.
The trainers don't seek counseling. It's the non special operations soldiers who are detailed to act as tower guards. They're not fully aware of what's going on and don't always understand the value of what is happening in front of them.
I don't think these guys are alone in failing to 'always understand the value of what is happening in front of them'. The testimony of Dr. Jerald Ogrisseg, who is the former head of Psychological Services for the Air Force SERE School, to the Senate Committee on Armed Services in September 2008 ( http://www.fas.org/irp/congress/2008_hr/treatment.html pages 21-64) is very illuminating and highlights the difference between SERE training and what goes on in real life.
These differences are described and discussed in Alex Knapp's excellent article 'SERE Training and Torture' ( http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/sere_training_and_torture /) if you have the time to take a look. It covers exactly the issue you raise: that because some of the techniques used against detainees are similar to those used at SERE, they are not ' torture ' - but comes to a different conclusion than you do.
First, comparing Air Force SERE school with anything real life is a mistake. I am talking about SERE Level C, which is the only one where they go to the lengths to realistically recreate a POW environment . Air Force SERE school could realistically be referred to as SERE Light.
I read the article, which overall, I would say is not far off base. Except they get some of the facts wrong. For example, the part about "regular debriefings" after interrogations. I don't know how the Air Force does it, but in SERE C you only get debriefed after the entire POW experience is through. This is done to maintain the continuity of the training and keep the stress levels high and more closely simulate real world environments.
Further, the goal of enhanced interrogation techniques is not inflict any kind of damage: physical, mental. The goal is to get actionable intelligence now, which it was shown to do effectively on Khalid Sheikh Mohammed.
Another error: the goal of SERE has nothing to do with enabling students to resist torture. They make it very clear that you will not resist torture. If the enemy wants you to say something bad enough, you're going to say it, period. If they want you to say that you are the tooth fairy, you can bet your bottom dollar you're going to say it. The goal of SERE school is to develop techniques that avoid torture in the first place. While not always possible, it beats the alternative of going into that kind of situation unprepared.
...Bush had torture chambers established in Iraq to justify a war on Iraq. Must have had a time machine, that damned evil genius.
And genius he must be, because he alone knew that the "intelligence" coming from the CIA was false and rationalized a war, when all those around him belived it was true. Ted Kennedy, may he rot in peace, Hillary and Bill, Nazi Pelosi and all the other neo-commies just insisted we needed to do something in Iraq to enforce the santions that had been flouted by Saddam. The lefty-implemented oil for palaces program was supposed to protect the real torturer in Saddam and his boys, but evil genius fouled up their plans by alone devising a plan to invade Iraq. Of course, by setting up prisons in Iraq in which he could torture and get false confessions to justify an invasion of that idylic, peaceful state.
Idiots.