While Obama and McCain slug it out on the national stage, voters in individual states are considering legislation that could have widespread repercussions. In the first of a special election series, Opposing Views examines Oregon’s Measure 58, a proposal that would require “English immersion” in Oregon public schools while limiting foreign language instruction. Do English immersion laws help or harm students? Figure out where you stand now; your state may be next. (Editor's Note: On November 4th, Oregon voters rejected Measure 58)
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Oregonians for Immigration Reform Urge a Yes Vote on Measure # 58
- From Oregonians for Immigration Reform
By Oregonians for Immigration Reform - Environmentally Responsible Immigration
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Use of Funds
It seems to me, reaing the opposition arguments, that the main point is the "cost.". Actually, the "cost" is the loss of funds for bilingual education. It is actually a "saving". I have red elsewhere that the money appropriated for ESL and bilingual classes can be spent for other purposes, and therefore, school districts tend to hang on to the programs long past the students' needs. I would like to have this point discussed.
- psydneyh
October 1, 2008 2:43PM
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Side: Uncommitted
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2 years isn't enough to learn academic language
Being immersed in English is great for learning English, it's lousy for learning math, social studies, science or any course with CONTENT.
It takes more than 2 years of English language learning to be able to do academic work in English. By limiting education opportunities for children who don't speak English (including many LEGAL residents), we lower the standards for all students. Teachers can't teach when many of the students don't know the vocabulary or complex language that it takes to understand math, science and other subjects vital to our national future.
- LinearMom
October 7, 2008 8:48PM
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Side: No
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Where did you come up with this?
I happen to know many scientists and engineers from foreign countries, and almost universally, they have had to learn English to be able to get their degrees, much less function as professionals.
It does NOT take more than 2 years to become functionally literate. If there is a problem with learning a language, likely there is a problem with education and a students capacity to learn as well.
I majored in Chemistry, and to a man in the field, only the less competent faild the German classes needed to be able to read the German literature. By the way, it only took one semester of German, to be functional.
It really comes down to a few simple ideas.
1. If you want to live in France, learn French.
2. If you don't want to have to learn German, don't put yoursef in the situation that requires having to KNOW German to be functional.
3. If you choose to live in a Foreign country, expect your children to end up learning the language. You are NOT protecting them from anything by resisting their education in that language.
Your blank assertion that it requires more than 2 years, indicates that you have no knowledge on this subject at all.
- tomcat2200
October 17, 2008 2:18PM
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Side: Yes
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We've Lived It
My family and I (all English-speaking Americans) moved to Hungary in 1993. Our children started in the public schools immediately, without knowing a word of Hungarian. Their teachers did nothing (except exhibit much patience and graciousness) in English. In less than 2 years, approx. three semesters, our kids were on par with their classmates. One of them continued through the Hungarian school system making straight A's, the other mostly B's.
Can it be done? Yes.
Was it good for our kids? Absolutely.
Did they suffer from it? Not in the least.
Would we do it again? In a heartbeat.
Having non-English speaking children go to English-speaking schools is NOT something new. It's what immigrants to the US have done from the beginning. The Italians, Greeks, Germans, Russians, Africans, Poles, Chinese - you name it. Why should Spanish-speakers be treated differently - and to their detriment?
One more thing: never underestimate the ability of children to learn a language. Given the chance, they will blow your socks off.
Aldjon meg az Úr!
Indyanna
- Indyanna
October 12, 2008 5:34AM
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Side: Yes
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I absolutely agree!
I couldn't have said it better myself! It's worked for decades, so if it ain't broke, don't fix it. If you live in America, you should be able to function as an American. It's very irritating to me to realize what the cost must be to translate any and all reading material, from instructions on assembling, to medications, along with hit 1 for English, which is especially irritating. From reading the above submission, I take it other countries assume if you're living there and attending their schools, you should be able to speak their language; which is the way it should be here. If you LIVE in America, speak the language!
- Glasscat
October 16, 2008 10:43AM
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Side: Yes
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Reply to Glasscat
Re: Glasscat's comment - "I take it other countries assume if you're living there and attending their schools, you should be able to speak their language;..."
Yes, that is correct. When my son entered high school, there was a girl in his class that had just moved to Hungary from Ukraine along with her family. She didn't speak a word of Hungarian (fyi, Ukrainian and Hungarian are not related at all).
So, even though she was in 9th grade, she took classes along with everyone else. My son told me that everyone in the class rallied around her and basically "adopted" her. By the end of the school year she was able to converse in Hungarian, and she graduated on time with everyone else.
One sidenote that I think is important to understand, and that is all European children are required to learn two foreign languages in school, sometimes three.
I don't know the specifics for the rest of Europe, but in Hungary the kids begin learning their first foreign language (usually English or German) in 4th grade, and they continue studying that language all the way through 12th grade. When they enter high school, they begin studying a second foreign language (often a Romance language) and continue studying that through 12th grade.
My point is that, among Europeans, it is expected that you are conversant in at least one language other than your native tongue, so being bilingual is not a big deal. I personally know people who can communicate in four languages, other than their native tongue. It's humbling, to say the least!
- Indyanna
October 17, 2008 2:41AM
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Side: Yes
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